the end, my last ending did not post for some reason

Could the ending be any worse? Butler does a good job of building the tension in the book and then it simply ends with Dana losing her arm to a dead guy that somehow turns into a wall. Where was the explanation in that. I feel like the reader had to assume so much for themselves. What happened to Nigel and Carrie?
Also, I am dissapointed in how the relationship between Dana and Rufus played out. I knew it was not going to happen but I at least had some hope. I and others were correct when we stated Rufus would not be able to change because his age in time would not allow it. The antebellum south was no place for a plantation owner who would be easy on his slaves. Well, although I do believe Rufus was influenced by his time, you could also make the argument that Rufus knew what he was doing when he would punish Dana or his slaves. Rufus and other plantation owners knew how to work their slaves and how to keep them entertained and to the point where freedom was not constantly on their minds (which is hard to imagine, I thought anyone enslaved would be thinking of freedom at all times). Rufus threw parties and allowed for Nigel and Carrie to have a proper wedding.
I am partially contempt with the novel because Butler gives her characters emotions that are realistic. In the case of Tom Weylin, he became softer towards Dana in his old age because he realized he would have to leave his plantation to his son and she was the one who protected Rufus. Margaret is another example. She also gave in to Dana because of her old age. She probably felt safer around Dana because Dana had saved her son's life and her knowlegde of medicine was beyond that of any doctor at that time.
Overall, the book is not one of my favorites, but it took us back in time to imagine the emotional and physical state of people in that century.

middle

After reaching what was about the mid-point of the book, my opinion of the novel changed. I still enjoyed the fresh approach Butler took in addressing the issue of race, but I felt the book was getting slightly tiresome. I think it is well-written and creatively original, but I seemed to experience a kind of feeling as if things were going nowhere. Everything seemed to remain stagnant in the sense that most of the text consists of Dana traveling back and forth from past to present. Maybe that's the feeling Butler intended for the reader to feel, though. It is possible that she hoped the reader would feel as if there was no solution to the problem, no hope for the future, etc. It is certainly a valid argument to raise. I, however, cannot be sure and only know my own feelings after reading this far.

end

to be honest the ending of the book was not what i expected. I think the book in general was ok. There was to much build-up through out the book for it to end the way it did.I would've liked it to end differently. i think Dana finished and accomplished what she had been wanting to for so many years this,i think, was hard for her.Only because she had to choose between saving her life or risking her future by killng Rufus.Her and Rufus had such a strong relationship that when it came down to choosing it was one that was not very easy to make.She had finally come to understand the pain and struggle her ancestors had gone through but even more importantly she realized that she could endure alot more than she ever thought possible. Although the book was alot more predictable than i would've imgined i found it interesting when I compared the life of Dana and Rufus.There was a big difference as well as many smilarities.

For instance while both were educated Dana was obviously more aware and intellectual of many things while Rufus on the other hand was a little bit more unaware at least when it came to illnesses and things of that nature. On the other hand Dana was unaware and often times really stubborn of her place in that specific period in time.

In closing the book was entertaining at some points but at others was very cliche. I do think though that it did a pretty good job of showng two drastic ways of living in hichmany different people called home.

1st thoughts

My first thoughts after reading the first chapter of Kindred were relatively positive. I loved the way Butler so easily drew me in as she began the book with such a mysterious, vague scene unfolding. I didn't want to put the book down because I think I secretly hoped Butler would explain to me why Dana's arm was missing...
I was also somewhat surprised that the book was associated so frequently with science-fiction. I thought maybe as the book continued that the time travel aspect would be elaborated upon more, but from reading the first chapter alone, it seems like the author chooses more to allow the reader to understand Dana's thoughts and emotions rather than delve into the details of time travel. I do also remember being extremely intrigued by the fact that the author chose to create such a distinguished time difference between the past and present in the sense that, while Dana is in the 1800s for a decent amount of time, merely ten to fifteen seconds passed in her absence in the present.

1st thoughts

The prologue captured my attention right away. I was surprised by how much excitement Octavia Butler was able to fit into a few short pages. By simply reading the prologue, one can already tell that this book will be filled with adventure, fear, and confusion. It is evident to me that while Dana's travels start out short, they will escalate throughout the book until finally resulting in massive amounts of lost time. The more Dana helps, the more she will be needed. She is depicted as a strong woman: one who has a good sense of priority. She is shown in sharp contrast to Rufus' mother, who is the stereotypical woman in distress. Dana knows that she has no time to think about how she appeared by a random river. She instead uses her first instincts in knowing that she must save the drowning boy. I believe that as the book goes on, her strength will increase to a high level. Once she has reached this level, she will either have to use her strength for one final heroic gesture or she will break and give up. It should be interesting to see how it plays out.

Intoductions

Hi, my name is Tina Longman and I live in Kerrville, Texas. I graduated from the small school of Our Lady of the Hills High School. We reached 80 kids this year! I was born in San Francisco, then moved to New Hampshire, and am now here in Texas. Needless to say, we have moved around a bit. I am planning on majoring in English and then going on to law school to study Environmental Law.
My favorite activity to participate in is Polocrosse. For those of you who have never heard of it, Polocrosse is pretty much just lacrosse on horseback. I also love watching musicals, playing volleyball, most horse activities, being a team member for ACTS retreats, reading, listening to music, etc. For anything else you want to know, just ask me!

Climax

Wow.... this was a little beyond my expectations. What surprises me about the ending is not the climactic death of Rufus by Dana's hands, but the fact that despite the ancestral roots and years (or months?) of protection for Rufus, there seemed to be little guilt for what she'd done despite the fact that she'd acted in self-defense. There's virtually no "family" connection at this point, and it's almost as though the reader forgets that they're related to each other. The climax takes none of this into account, until the epilogue mentions the geneology that Dana and Kevin discover, and my reaction was "Oh yeah! They were family.... how could I have forgotten?" Rufus fell in love with Dana; Dana killed Rufus. After all is accomplished, and the bond of protection is broken, even the sanctity of blood couldn't serve to prevent the tragedy that would eventually occur. Cold irony...(No happy ending, but then we all knew she'd lose an arm, right?)

It was obvious from the moment Dana went home that Alice would do something tragic. After Hagar was born and Rufus' life becomes less significant to perpetuate the following generations, nothing could change the course of history or cause a truly positive outcome. They had both played their roles. I still don't understand, despite all that occured, why cold, indifferent fate chose to submit Dana to retribution for her deed by taking her arm--which, it seems, was the cause for the horrible effect. (Haha... but, I noticed that it didn't take her writing arm. Just chance?...) "Something cold and nonliving." I suppose fate dealt Rufus a worse punishment.

For the most part, all other aspects of the story followed a fairly predictable pattern: the danger to Rufus--and to Dana--gradually crescendoed into a finality that couldn't be avoided by any natural force except for history and fact. Slavery in America's past was ugly and harsh, just like the end of Kindred. Perhaps this is the reason for the lack of a positive outcome. By lending a hand in her ancestor's death--whether inevitably or by chance--Dana paid the price for taking a life that was not hers to take. The result is complex, and the end is harsh.

MIdpoint

As I'd thought, Dana has gone through most of the foreshadowings I'd seen at the beginning of the novel. Butler's style seems very predictable at this point, almost to the point of cliche, but there have been a few unexpected twists. (Actually, now that I think of it they really weren't so unexpected at all...)

I notice that Butler attempts to fuse historical references into the sequence of events to make the story semi-informal for the reader, almost like side-notes in an encyclopedia. For instance, she mentions the KKK with the effect of a dictionary definition: "Patrols. Groups of young whites who ostensibly maintained order among the slaves. Patrols. Forefunners of the Ku Klux Klan" (37). She uses research to draw the reader to a past time with information she'd obviously attained for the purpose, and the effect is that the story is more of a history lesson than a drama. This is useful, but as a form of literature it seems to lack stucture. I still don't understand why Dana is brought to the past to protect her ancestors, or the link that time plays in the story, and it seems that these will remain unsolved mysteries and only serve as a means to "experience" the historical events.

One thing that intrigues me, however, is Rufus' character. He seems ambiguous, and it's difficult to tell whether he'll become good or bad, and seems to represent Dana's desire for "goodness" to come of her experience. The potential for a postitve change, also capable of monstrosities. If Rufus develops as a person, the change will come because he's the time link for Dana, and I'm sure this will be a crucial defining moment in the novel.

It really amazes me, as I read the story, that self-righteousness and religion can be twisted to a point to make evil justifiable. I notice that the Weylins' treatment of the slaves, however, is surprisingly bereft of these "righteous" excuses. Instead, it's mainly for profit in the plantation. The greatest emotion I form as I read the story is frustration at the blindness and ignorance that are contained within the family, bitter and empty because of selfishness for the cost of economic growth. Selfishness, I think, is the cause of Rufus' ruthless attitude, attempting to get his wishes met at all cost to those he loves.

Yay! I'm done!

So it all has a relatively happy ending - Dana slays the evil slave owner. I figured she would, just not like this. In the chapter, "The Fire", when she was still new to that age, Dana used violence stricktly for survival . After being tackled and beaten by a man, she was perfectly capable of defending herself against him - and she did, eventually: "In that instant, I knew I could... destroy him...The thought sickened me, froze my hands where they were... My chance was gone, and I'd done nothing" (pg. 42). She settles for simply incapacitating him.

But what I'd found interesting was that when faced with death, when the decision of whether to dipose of her attacker or not could not be dwelled on, Dana had some trouble. But later, when Rufus tried to rape her, and immediate survival was not the issue, she had no problem with making the decision to end his life. (I'm not saying I wouldn't either, but one could argue that Dana has been bumped down a peg, ethically.) Maybe she was still really peeved at all the other stuff he did...

Kindred was a good read, but not nearly as good as Beloved, by Toni Morrison. Seriously guys, that book is intense.

"Slavery was a long slow process of dulling"

Dana's character still interests me. For example, upon learning from Rufus that she was in the year 1815, she did not flip out (I don't think I could say that about myself), but rather, she "sat still" and believed him (pg. 27). At times I thought Butler should have made Dana more jumpy at first so that by the end of the novel, her transformation into a slavemaster-killing-machine would be more apparent.

I noticed that some of the other characters have adapted to a life of slavery, but in a different way. Sarah, for instance, "...had done the safe thing - had accepted a life of slavery because she was afraid... She was the kind of woman who would be held in contempt during the militant nineteen sixties" (pg. 145). I suppose I can say that this novel is about transformation, and that not all transformation is good.

And actually I had a question: What's up with the title "Marse"? Is it short for "Master"?